I made a Manchego a couple months ago, and since I didn’t have any pH marks for that type cheese I was guessing my way through.  I decided to go with a 6.0 at draining.  The cheese is now being consumed and its exceedingly delicious - I seasoned it with some dehydrated onion leaves.  However, its too dry - to the point of being somewhat crumbly.  I have never had that with a Manchego before; but, like I said, I was guessing my way through a new process.  Sooo, I’m going to make another in the morning and increase the pH somewhat.  Would 6.5 be too much, or does it sound reasonable as a next step??  I’m still fairly new at the pH process; and I’m a bit unsure how much change will be achieved with how much difference in acidity.  Some advice from you “old hands” would be appreciated.

Well, as they say, the best laid plans of mice and men often go astray.  I had hoped to drain at 6.5, but when I finished the cook and checked the pH, it was already down to 6.2.  So I drained it right away and got it in the press.  Hopefully, the .2 increase in pH is going to be enough to give me the moist texture I’m after.  I should also say that with the modifications to the recipe that I’ve made, its really not a Manchego any more.  I’ve removed the thermophilic starter from the recipe and just use mesophilic.  Also, instead of brining the wheel after pressing, I add the salt to the curd prior to pressing, albeit a slightly reduced amount.  All in all, it makes a fantastic cheese.

It sounds like the acid ran away again for it to be crumbly. .2 can make a big difference so hoping it turned out well. Its just a matter of practice so u can see the difference between PH’s.

Yeah, I’m still learning on this pH stuff.  I stole a taste of the wheel out of the press and I was quite impressed.  Its looking about right to seal up and put in the cave.  I’ll continue to experiment with this one; and when I feel its right, I’ll post the recipe.

6.5 is too high for a Manchego. Manchego should be drained at 6.2-6.3 and allowed to acidify after that during the flips. It’s not quite as high in calcium as a tomme, but very similar. Moistness is curd is not determined by acid levels as much as it is by the length of time that the curd sets after adding rennet and the size of the curd. Longer set means more moisture. Bigger curd means more moisture. Curd adhesion/crumbliness is determined by acidity. For example, a fresh brie is fully acidified to pH 4.6, right, but it’s a very moist cheese.

So, I’m out of luck on curd size with this one, since it is supposed to be whisked to rice-sized pieces.  Are you saying that I need to let it set longer prior to cutting in order to increase moisture content?  I thought it was the cook that determined moisture loss/retention - is that wrong???

The length of cook time does determine the total overall moisture loss before pressing. But, in the press, the cheese will still continue to release whey. Again, the example of a camembert/brie. You drain it and it still releases whey, just slowly. If you cut the camembert curd to smaller pieces, like 1” cubes, or if you did not wait long enough for a very solid set, or both, moisture level would be lower. Does that make sense? In order of influence, it is the length of set, followed by curd size, followed by cook temp and cook length (they’re about tied) for what determined moisture content.

linuxboy - 14 June 2010 01:14 PM

In order of influence, it is the length of set, followed by curd size, followed by cook temp and cook length (they’re about tied) for what determined moisture content.

OK, I’m trying out your advice this morning on a Monterey Jack.  My last one - a pepper jack - is delicious, but somewhat dry; so I wanted to work on the Jack recipe for a while.  This time I got a really good solid set, and I’ve cut the curd larger.  Then, I drained at 5.9 and its currently in the press.  The curd was softer than the last make.  The cook went well, but the holding at temp was shortened by the arrival of the desired pH level.  I just flipped it for the final press, and its got a nice soft, bread dough feel to it.  Oh, I forgot to mention, I also used MM100 starter instead of the usual MA11.

Sounds good, Rich. The MM100 will give you some buttery notes, but also a little CO2 formation, so you’ll have openings in the cheese. Keep in mind that more moist cheeses mature a lot faster. That jack should be good to nibble in 45-60 days, and likely will start declining after 4-6 months unless you refrigerate it.

Thanks.  Sounds encouraging.  I don’t think I’ll have to worry about it “declining.”  It won’t last that long.